universal health care

Posted By: birdieman
Posted on: Nov. 12, 2006 at 11:17 PM

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as a new user but someone that listens to the radio show, i want to know about universal health care. it's a nice idea and all, but what does it really mean? what I don't understand about liberals is that you are willing to give everyone's health information to the government, but cry foul about library records or if a phone call is being tapped? let me know how that works. if the patriot act and military commisions acts are so bad, why are you ready to give my health information away? does this not make any sense to you? it doesn't to me.

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prometheus

Nov. 13, 2006 at 01:05:52 AM

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Do we have one person pretending to be 4 other people here or what?

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Phaedrus

Nov. 13, 2006 at 06:36:52 AM

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Universal Healthcare means that thru a system much like Medicare and Medicaid, and the VA hospital system, and private insurers, every American would, could, and should have some healthcare. Those who can afford fancy, shmancy healthcare deals could get those, and those who're too poor would recieve Medicare, or a voucher to use for private insurance. The folks in the middle would have the option of spending their own money on the fancy shmancy, or go the route of govt healthcare.

As for the Feds getting your medical records, no one is arguing for that. Your personal info would still be protected by your's and your doctor's Constitutional Rights.

So the reason it makes no sense is that you're comparing/comfusing apples and oranges.

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Kevin Zahn

Nov. 13, 2006 at 12:26:27 PM

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One way to think about health care, universal or whatever, is to ask yourself if the fact that about 20 million children in the country do NOT have any health care shows our
good, moral values? If you are Christian, you can research stories in the Bible where Jeses helped heal the sick and encouraged us to help the sick and the poor, etc. Or, you can have a purely secular view and ask yourself things such as, Which workers/citizens are more productive, sick ones, or healthy ones? You can research many other countries who have what we might call universal health care and see how it works . . . in reply to what Phaedrus commented, I have a friend who is a doctor whose parents live in China. He just came back from there and I asked, amongst other things, how health care in China is run. Basically there is a two-level system, where everyone is covered on the first level. If you need care, you go to the local office, or clinic and get it. If you have enough money, however, you can avoid the public clinics and go to a private one... I think when American companies get to the point where they realize, if done correctly, they might save money by NOT having to provide health care to their employees, there will be more of a push for this, driven as we/they are for profits. As I read it, things like company health care and other benefits grew rapidly in WWII in order to attract and keep better workers at short-handed plants and factories. . . . in other words, it does not have to be employer based, that's just the way it delveloped. It would take bold thinking and action to change all this, but just maybe we will get to the point where that is possible...

--KZ

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Hunter

Nov. 13, 2006 at 05:57:41 PM

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Bulls***, Bulls***, BULLs***

Do either on of you "it's for the children because god wants it" socialist's have the slightest frigg'in clue how fast "universal healthcare" will bankrupt this country. Hell, Medicare alone is going to do us in starting in 08.

And stop hiding behind the phrase "universal healthcare" and be a man, call it what it really is. It's f***ING socialism, and Phardrus your living in a lead mine if you think there will be any "options" to socialized healthcare. It'll be a one size fits all system, just like medicare.

Oh and your medical records, if the feds the insurance provider, don't you think they'll review your records, maybe just a little my socialist commrads.

Here's an idea, before you cheerlead for another, doomed to fail, big brother government program I want you fully inform yourselves as to just how deep the Feds stick there nose in our healthcare system already. I want you to read HIPPA- the Health Insurance Portability and Privacy Act.

Mic should be able to help you out, I'm sure he's gone through the Medicare class at least once.

And how much is enough? How many failed programs will you have to witness before you give freedom a shot?

OH, I want one more thing. I want you to have the courage to join the IRS once this is passed and be the first to knock on my front door to collect my "fair share"

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indie616

Nov. 13, 2006 at 08:14:24 PM

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Hunter, you can call Bulls*** if you want. However, I work daily with the healthcare system and I will tell you it is bulls*** the way it works (or more aptly doesn't work) right now.

I am the Director for 3 medical practices (radiology). I am run the operations from the first phone call to trying to collect the monies due. In other words, entry to exit.

If I could run a Medicare only practice, I would do it in a minute.

1) Medicare is a low paperwork provider. Signing up involves about 3 forms, and once you have completed them, you are done for good.
On the other hand, private payors require mounds of paperwork almost every year.

2) Medicare provides patients the right to see the physician of their choice and to be seen in the hospital of their choice. Many private payors restrict the patient from seeing the doc/hospital of their choice.

3) Medicare does not require pre-authorizations for office visits or procedures. They have a static set of rules and as long as you abid by them you will get paid.
Private payors add layers upon layers of paperwork and require offices to employ many more clerical folks to complete the paperwork. Private payors also take valuable time from the physician to deal with paperwork.

4) Private payors restrict patients from getting tests that their doctor deems necessary. Private payors are for profit entities, and are more worried about their stocks than providing healthcare. Check out the salary and stock options for the United Healthcare CEO........how many patients were denied necessary tests for him to make his millions of dollars?

5) Medicare pays for services rendered within 2-3 weeks. If you file a clean claim, you have the money in the bank via EFT. Private plans will have "glitches" in their system that ALWAYS favor them. To deal with their crooked schemes, many more clerical on the provider side are necessary to re-file, call, and fight for the money for services rendered.

Private insurance is the greatest jobs program ever. I can tell you right now, if we had a single payor system based on Medicare, I could lay off 25% of my clerical staff, and Primary Care and specialists could probably get rid of even more.

Medicare pays us about $37.00 to perform a Chest X-ray. Can you get a plumber or AC guy to drive to your house to tell you that you have an AC unit or a faucet-much less fix it? I mean really, $37.00 bucks? That includes the cost of the Radiologist reading. Seems pretty reasonable.

There is much to fix with healthcare in this country. Here are some of my ideas:

1) Malpractice reform. Doc's order tests all day long to cover their asses. This raises the cost of healthcare dramatically.

2) Single payor system to provide BASIC healthcare for all citizens. I believe it was Kevin Z/Phaedrus who laid out the ideas for a tiered system. That has a few flaws but is a good idea.

3) Coverage for preventive care.

4) Quality indicators. Some clown down the street who has not upgraded his MRI equipment for 15 years should not be paid the same as my office which keeps up the the median for technology.

5) STOP SELF REFERRALS!

I could go on and on. But I will stop for now. Or as AZ Moderate might say...don't get me started.

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Phaedrus

Nov. 13, 2006 at 09:06:27 PM

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First, a little joke for Indie, and a question for Hunter; Hunter do you take a tax deduction for your healthcare costs? And if so, how is that not taking tax dollars for your healthcare?

The joke is that he will never answer. Right Indie?

Working in the finance industry, I can tell you stories of people who work hard, pay their bills, and go to get a mortgage, only to find their 750 fico is now a 580. Why? Because they have medical insurance, that when presented with a bill fights the provider/doctor and refuses payment. Then the doctor, clinic, hospital and every specialist who came in contact with the patient, in order to recieve their payment turns around and files a collection with all 3 credit bureaus against the patient. So now someone who follows all the rules is screwed.

If Congress, and the President were to devise a perfect system that maximized the health and well being of the nation, what we have today would be it's opposite.

Your call for removing the govt from healthcare entirely is also completely ok by me Hunter. Within 9 months living under such a system, the people of the USA and the medical professionals would be marching in the streets for socialized healthcare. The reality is without all of the tax breaks given to employers and workers, and all of the subsidies given to hospitals for training doctors, and to schools for educating them healthcare in the US would be so expenive that it would only be affordable by the extremely wealthy.

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indie616

Nov. 13, 2006 at 09:41:49 PM

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Those people that say that healthcare is not a right, are, well right. It is a NECESSITY!!!

I would rather see the patient that has a little 2x3 cm fuzzy area on their Chest x-ray in an outpatient setting, then have my compatriots see the patient in the hospital with a full blown 1/2 lung pneumonia. The difference- about $5000 to $8000. The guy without insurance is going to wait until it is necessary (thinks he is dying) to go to the ER.

Or I would rather see the patient with a little cough, then have them in the ER hacking up blood and finding they have TB and have infected who knows how many people. And just for the laymen out there, TB has become more and more drug resistant. And the treatment for TB under the best circumstances is not a fun thing to deal with.

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