Who is going to live in my Grand Children's world?

Posted By: Johnny Green
Posted on: Sep. 3, 2006 at 3:49 PM

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I am mad, disgusted, disappointed, depressed, and just plain fed up with the things I see around the world today. I grew up in a country that had certain values and principles and I could support and uphold most of those principles.

But now I see a bunch of zealots who are basically nothing but thugs running the country and I'm not even sure that they are in office legally and I'm sure that they are not doing the things they are doing with the consent of the thinking man or woman. How could "we the people" allow these things to happen? An invasion of another country thereby profiting off the invasion with no bid contracts to companies in which members of the administration personally profit?

The deaths of who knows how many innocents? The deaths of over 2500 American servicemen? The mortal wounds of who knows how many american servicemen that the government and news media will not tell us about? Capturing and torturing thousands (another number that is not readily available) of people who may or may not be guilty of anything but have probably not violated any US laws and therefore are being held illegally.

The attack on 9/11 happened. I don't know what happened but can't believe there weren't planes or people on the planes or that these zealots took down the buildings themselves. Not that I don't believe they are capable of doing it. That said, I don't believe the story they have given the American Public. Just one look at the video of Bush being notified and the look on his face gives me the impression that he either

(1) knew and was shaking his head like Ok it's here

(2) Expected something just didn't know what it would be or

(3) just didn't care as long as he could get his photo op.

They (this administration) have lied about everything they have done and expect to be believed therefore flipping every one of us the finger and saying if we don't like it tough. They're in charge. These people were either complicent, knew it was coming and let it happen (so they could have another Pearl Harbor) or were grossly incompetent. Either way they have used the tragedy to further their goals of world domination at the detriment of the people they have pledged to serve and protect. I don't think any of us will ever know the real truth about the events of 9/11 but it did accomplish what these zealots hoped for. Americans needed to attack someone because "THEY ATTACKED US ON OUR OWN SOIL". And thus Afghanistan, Iraq and................? Fill in the blanks. We all know that they are now setting their sights on Iran because you can hear the same drum beat today that you heard just prior to Iraq.

Will anyone stop them? Can anyone stop them? Can't anyone see that this could lead to the destruction of the world?

Do they really believe in the things that the religous whacko's are saying about the middle east and all this garbage (for lack of the word I really wanted to use) about this needing to be done before the end of the world and Rapture or whatever other nut ideas they are professing?

I'm sorry but I'm scared, I'm really scared and it's not for me for I've already lived most of my life. I'm scared for my children, their children and their children's children. I'm wondering that if the world is still around for them what kind of a world will it be?

I'm not a scholar and can't do the research most can on this board and can't put my thoughts together as well as I'd like but I'm so sick of getting F****d by these zealots and not even getting kissed.

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prometheus

Sep. 4, 2006 at 08:29:01 AM

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I hear ya, John Green. At this point, it is about our children . . . and their children. These Morons have sold us out, and the world that awaits our kids is possibly far worse than any science fiction future world. America is on track to become Beyond third world . . . These un-american neo-fascist want to create an American 4th world (far worse than most of Mexico). I hope voting can hehttps://recorder.maricopa.gov/earlyvoteballot/evbrequest.aspxlp finally elimanate the maggots!

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indie616

Sep. 6, 2006 at 06:21:15 PM

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I feel your pain JG.

However, we can change things by voting, and helping educate others on what is really going on.

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www.MoronInCharge.com

Sep. 6, 2006 at 09:18:17 PM

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At least you're scared for the right reasons Johnny. The Bushies are doing all in their power to irrationally scare you with everything else - terrorists, Iran, illegal immigrants, mucacas, liberals - because they have nothing else left in their bag. I truly hope that Americans have finally wised up, because if they fall for the carnival tricks again, then we really do have everything to fear.

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tonyd

Sep. 6, 2006 at 10:37:44 PM

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Keep playing that Sax Johnny and be thankful we are fighting for the children. Or you can bury your head in your horn and wait to be hit on our soil. You are right Johnny let them chop off our domes, bomb our embassy, bomb our ship, try to smuggle liquid explosives, try to blow us up by lighting shoes on fire, blow up trains in other countries, be human suicide bombers. Bush is behind it Johnny; getting that photo opp and he knew about it, you know I bet he planned it so he could get the oil. I think maybe you burst a vessel in your head while blowing on the sax. You might want to see a doctor and do your homework before writing such crap. Just keep sitting back and do nothing, that's the answer Johnny. It's all Bushes fault. You're a stinkin Genius Johnny, welcome to the board, you will be welcome with open arms writing that dribble. You got one thing right, you are no scholar

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AZ Moderate

Sep. 6, 2006 at 10:54:17 PM

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Johnny Green, here's your challenge:

“I fervorently hope that your kind will beat the Bushes to identify the suicidal among you for what and who they are – and neutralize them. Beat around the Bush to educate those that are just misled. To do less is to cut your day in the sun short. There’s no place else in the universe for you.”

Get the whole story in "Galactic Thesis – Self Extinction Behavior in Emerging Species." at http://www.voiceofarizona.com/content/p/5031/catid/37/artid/2845?p=5031&artid=2845#comments

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www.MoronInCharge.com

Sep. 7, 2006 at 01:55:53 AM

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Tony, I couldn't help but notice that you have brought up the embassies in East Africa and the USS Cole again. These events obviously prove that Clinton was soft on terrorism and 9-11 is a direct result of his complacency, right?

You are aware, I trust, that Clinton was blocked by the Republican controlled congress in 1996 from passing more stringent anti-terrorism laws. I believe Senator Orin Hatch called it "a phony issue." Kind of hard to be a tough on terrorists when Republicans are accusing you of playing "wag the dog" politics.
link:[www.cnn.com]

BTW, the USS Cole was attacked in Oct. 2000, three month before Clinton left office. Any military response would have rightfully been the job of the incoming President, Dubya. Instead the Bush Administration chose to focus on matters that they deemed more important: the threat of financially crippled Russia and the imperative to find a reason to invade Iraq (long before 9-11 occurred). http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/01/10/oneill.bush/ They completely ignored the warnings of the outgoing Clinton Administration Counterrorism Czar Richard Clarke and NSA Director Sandy Berger that terrorism would be the Bush Administration's single most important priority.

As for the so called multiple opportunities that Clinton had to get OBL's head on a platter or to take him out, the claim that Clinton passed up these opportunities was dispelled by the bipartisan 9-11 Commission Report. Why, Presidential Medal of Freedom award winner himself, CIA Director George Tenet advised Clinton that the intelligence in all cases was unactionable because it was based upon unreliable and suspect single sources. To commit to military action under those conditions would be as reckless and irresponsible as . . . as to go to war based on the unsubstantiated claims of men like Chilabi or "Curveball."
link:[mediamatters.org]

But let us just for a moment imagine that the responsibility for 9-11 falls squarely on the shoulders of Bill Clinton. Imagine this even though Dubya had been in office for 8 months already, ignored the warnings of the outgoing Administration, ignored specific FBI reports of terrorists wanting to fly planes into buildings, and ignored a Presidential Daily Briefing (put together as the best and most current intelligent assessment possible for keeping our Commander in Chief in the know) stating OBL determined to strike in the US. And let's remember that Clinton is responsible for Bush not ramping up the security at our ports and borders, not issuing any warning for local and federal law enforcement agencies, not alerting the FAA to be on alert, not flying more sky marshalls, not coordinating disaster drills (too busy dismantling FEMA I guess), and basically not doing a damn thing in the weeks before 9-11 while all the warning signs were flashing around the otherwise preoccupied vacationing President. It was all Clinton's fault because poor little Bush Jr. simply walked into a mess left to by the preceeding slob in office. Of course, if that's the case, then Papa Bush is really responsible for the first WTC bombing in Feb. 2003. That occurred only one month after Clinton took office.

Oh, and that crap about the White House being vandalized by the outgoing Clintonites -- completely debunked. Apparently the "Uniter" started "dividing" the day after stepping into office.
link:[www.fair.org]

Please notice two things about this comment.
1. I didn't spend any time personally insulting you.
2. I respect your intelligence enough to provide you sources for my claims.

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indie616

Sep. 7, 2006 at 07:34:48 AM

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There you go again MiC...you and all your silly facts.

Facts don't matter to conservatives. Want proof? You have laid out, in documentable fashion, the truth. Yet Tonyd, and others, will resort to rehashing their false assertions in some future post.

You know what I would like to hear? A debate between you and Tonyd on the V of AZ radio show. Then Tony couldn't hide after making his assertions. I think that show would be great!!!

What do you say V of AZ? Can you make that happen? And, if so, would Tony have the guts to do it?

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Johnny Green

Sep. 7, 2006 at 04:22:51 PM

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******************************************************

"Keep playing that Sax Johnny and be thankful we are fighting for the children"

******************************************************

Maybe you could explain to me who the "we" you refer to is. I spent 20 years in the Army fighting for the "children" where was Bush?

******************************************************
"let them chop off our domes, bomb our embassy, bomb our ship, try to smuggle liquid explosives, try to blow us up by lighting shoes on fire, blow up trains in other countries, be human suicide bombers"
******************************************************

Maybe you could also explain to me who "them" (or they} are. During the 20 years I served I was told that I was protecting the country against "them". Now that I look at what this administration has done and is doing all in the name of protecting us I feel that we have become "them".

******************************************************
"Bush is behind it Johnny; getting that photo opp and he knew about it, you know I bet he planned it so he could get the oil."
******************************************************

Actually I don't think Bush is behind it. I don't give him credit for that much intelligence. However can you honestly look at that video and see any shock or surprise in his face?

******************************************************
"Just keep sitting back and do nothing, that's the answer Johnny. It's all Bushes fault."
******************************************************

Actually the reason I wrote the article is because I got tired of sitting back and doing nothing. I don't believe it's all Bushes fault I don't think he cares one way or another. I believe that he's just some imbecile with a name that the Neo-con's put in office and without his handlers would be the utter failure that he's always been. I also believe that he's an embarrassment to this country and he makes me sick. No I don't blame Bush I blame his handlers and people like you who blindly follow and believe the old adage "my country right or wrong".

******************************************************
"You're a stinkin Genius Johnny, welcome to the board, you will be welcome with open arms writing that dribble. You got one thing right, you are no scholar"
******************************************************

I will not reply in kind and unsult you as you did me. You have a constitutional right to your opinion. A right which you seem to be denying me. No I am not a scholar but I have lived a few years and seen a few things. I know first hand the horror of war. I've seen americans bleed and die for a cause protecting those like you from the "them" you keep railing about. Have you?

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www.MoronInCharge.com

Sep. 7, 2006 at 08:48:35 PM

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Tony, who said this?

"Once the terrorist attacks started there was no way that we could really contribute to the original mission by staying there as a target just bunkering down and waiting for further attacks. I don't think we have lost as yet, although I know things don't look too bright. As long as there is a chance we are not bugging out. We are moving to deploy into a more defensive position."

Was it Jack Murtha, trying to put a nice spin on weak liberal cut-and-run grandstanding?

Was it John Kerry, or Hilary Clinton, or Howard Dean?

Maybe it was a conspiracy theorist head-in-the-sand liberal talk show pundit like Al Franken?

Well, as it turns out, you need look no further than the picture you chose as your online avatar. Ronald Reagan, the father of neoconservatism, said this in February 1984 to explain why he was pulling US troops out of Lebanon four months after the Iranian backed terrorists (that would later be known as Hezbollah) killed 241 American servicemen in the Beirut Marine barracks bombing of October 23, 1983.

link:[news.bbc.co.uk]

It's pretty hard to believe, I know, because it almost seems like he was giving in to the terrorists demands to remove foreign troops from that country. However, as AA likes to say, when viewed through the prism of history this should come as no surprise. Twenty years later George W. Bush did pretty much the same thing - quietly and unceremoniously - when he closed the Prince Sultan US military air base in Saudi Arabia, just as Osama bin Laden demanded. Bin Laden stated he wanted foreign infidels out of the Islamic holy land of Saudi Arabia. We obliged. He also stated that he intended to financially drain the US, getting us to spend one million dollars for every dollar he spends. With our response to 9-11, choosing to invade Iraq rather than chase bin Laden, we did that too.

link:[www.cnn.com]

Now I know you have this hard on for blaming terrorism on Clinton, but it sure seems to me that Reagan and W have been the terrorists best friend. Why hell, more stay-the-course like we're doing in Iraq, and Afghanistan will be 100% Taliban again in no time! Not that Bin Laden will wish to relocate to Afghanistan now that our good ally Pakistan has made Northern Waziristan such a great destination resort location for Al Queda.

Bush has had five years to establish his bona fides in the war on terrorism -- six if you include the first year of his presidency spent ignoring the existence of a terroist threat. This should be long enough to lay the blame for his failed anti-terrorism policies, unhindered by a sycophantic lap dog Republican controlled congress, squarely on his shoulders. The Administration and their apologists only excuse now seems to be the claim that the US would miraculously emerge victorious in this war if only we could silence all critics, torture more, spy freely, spend without end, and sacrifice more lives to the noble cause.

If you feel like you need to pull on this thread of causality and desperately trace the blame back to Clinton, then keep tugging. Pretty soon, Ronnie won't have any sweater.

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indie616

Sep. 7, 2006 at 09:58:09 PM

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Well, my goodness. Seems to me like Tony is going to have a dickens of a time with these additional facts.

Perhaps he can not answer due to being in the last throes of his insurgency.

Perhaps he believes the Mission is Accomplished.

Here are a couple more tidbits:

"In Congress, Clinton was thwarted by the reactionary conservative majority in virtually every attempt he made to pass legislation that would attack al-Qaeda and terrorism. His 1996 omnibus terror bill, which included many of the anti-terror measures we now take for granted after September 11, was withered almost to the point of uselessness by attacks from the right; Senators Jesse Helms and Trent Lott were openly dismissive of the threats Clinton spoke of.

Specifically, Clinton wanted to attack the financial underpinnings of the al-Qaeda network by banning American companies and individuals from dealing with foreign banks and financial institutions that al-Qaeda was using for its money-laundering operations. Texas Senator Phil Gramm, chairman of the Banking Committee, gutted the portions of Clinton's bill dealing with this matter, calling them "totalitarian"

link:[www.smirkingchimp.com]

"Just before departing office, Clinton managed to make a deal with the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development to have some twenty nations close tax havens used by al-Qaeda. His term ended before the deal was sealed, and the incoming Bush administration acted immediately to destroy the agreement."

Hey Tony, can you tell me how many times the Cheney led anti-terrorism group met before 9-11? I will make it easy for you via multiple choice:
A) Once
B) Thrice
C) Never
D) It doesn't matter, 9-11 was all Clinton's fault.

Hint: It is not A,B or D. Good Luck.

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