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When I was coming of age in the late sixties, the term “Generation Gap” was used widely. It was an attempt on the part of both sides of the Gap to reconcile the strong emotions involved. The biggest issues of the day were the Vietnam War and the military draft. The older generation generally did not understand the abhorrence of the younger generation. The older generation had fought the good fight of World War II and looked at Vietnam as a continuation of the same fight. Vietnam was the first war to be televised on a daily basis; the horrors of that war were in our living rooms everyday. There was no avoiding the flag-draped coffins coming back. The entire population was asked to make sacrifices. Families were ripped apart over these issues.
Middle and lower class America were where the Generation Gap occurred. Upper class America had methods at their disposal that any of them wishing to avoid service in Vietnam, was able to do so (i.e. Bush’s Air National Guard enlistment). Many sons were disowned when they decided to avoid the draft by going underground or moving to Canada. Many families still feel guilt over encouraging their sons to go fight in the war only to have them return dead, maimed, or emotionally crippled for life. In the best of cases reconciliation occurred. The end of the Vietnam War brought the end of the draft. America has since operated with all-volunteer Armed Forces.
It should be noted that in Vietnam unlike the Gulf Wars, there were NO reservists or National Guard troops called up to duty in country. This is because neither Johnson nor Nixon felt they had the political capital necessary to make such a move. The mainstream media would not have let them get away with doing so. Not only is the Bush regime allowed doing so with impunity, many reservists and Guard members have now served multiple tours in Iraq. The Generation Gap of today occurs not just because of age but also because of experiential knowledge. Those of my age and older remember the sacrifices of Vietnam. We are well aware of our peers and siblings that will never be the same. In the end Vietnam was a huge tragedy with its unneeded loss of human life and potential, no matter what high ideals were the motivation.
To be sure, only the most gullible still believe there are similar high ideals for the war in Iraq. The Generation Gap that exists today is one of ignorance and apathy. Most young people have no strong feelings either way about the Iraqi war. This is exactly what Bush wants. The country is not asked to make any wartime sacrifices. There is a subtle but definite dismissal of any concerns for the troops, “They all knew what they were getting into when they volunteered.” The middle and lower classes are so busy trying to make a living and eat; there is no time to be concerned about how they’re being shafted by the Bush regime.
It is our duty to close the current Generation Gap. Education is necessary to replace the ignorance propagated by the current administration. We must make those in ignorance realize the number of deaths occurring, both American and Iraqi. The only way to truly support the troops is to bring them home now. Apathy may be the end of the grand experiment that is democracy in America.
Offend a Conservative – Use Your Brain
The Current Generation Gap
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Posted By: A Proud Liberal Posted on: Jul. 26, 2006 at 2:28 AM  11 Comments
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Jul. 26, 2006 at 03:24:29 PM
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| A Proud Liberal , I don’t think the current situation can be explained by a generation gap. It is trite, perhaps, to say that the gap is between George W. Bush’s ears, but he is after all the mindless hood ornament on the NeoCoNazi political hummer. The gap seems to be between that 23% of American “Brown shirts” (every population has them) that will heil and salute der Maximum Leader without question, and the great silent majority that is not motivated by dogma and driven to blind obedience as a refuge from themselves. That gap will always be there, because that 23% will always be part of the human family. The trick is to see to it that they are seen for what they are and are not allowed to gain power over the rest of us, as they have so notably in the past in such places as Germany and Japan. “OOOH - here the truth comes out - the MEDIA run the show around here !!! The MEDIA dictates what the government can and can not do !!” Ohio Nut Case, I think you missed the point. An independent and objective investigatory Fourth Estate is supposed to act as a check on government by exposing secret government excesses. This is not dictating to the government, it is enlightening the people so that they can intelligently reign in the abusive use of power granted to the politicians by the people. That function has been compromised since 9/11 by a very skillful NeoCoNazi strategy and a fat dumb Consumer population that has been encouraged to finance an unending shopping spree to support the war. To the extent that the Fourth Estate has been compromised, our Constitutional Democratic Republic is under siege by those that disdain it. “Do you think maybe the lack of war-time scarifices is mainly due to the fact that this country is in better financial / agricultural / industrial / technological shape than it was back then?!?!” Not only NO, but HELL NO!!!! See above, and may I refer you to “American Theocracy” by Kevin Phillips, Part III, “Borrowed Prosperity”. |
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Jul. 26, 2006 at 05:03:19 PM
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| This guys an ass reposting crap all over the place. I will make no furthur comment on anything unless it is original.
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Jul. 27, 2006 at 12:36:11 AM
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| PL, don't be put off by AA's standoffishness. He always greets new liberals this way. He's actually a nice guy in person. You can judge his politics for yourself. ONC, you make good points in your 2nd and 3rd paragraphs. But . . . The media did not make the difference between WWII and Vietnam. Fighting a real threat with a real coalition with a real committment and a real moral justification made the difference And I will remind you that the post-war occupation of Germany/Japan went a lot smoother than Iraq - media's fault? Hell, we hardly see any of the real carnage in Iraq on the U.S. news. We don't even see the flag-drapped coffins. The media's not the bully - the media's been castrated. BTW, we're making wartime sacrifices, in the form of $300 billion going straight to the debt projected to be $10 trillion by 2008. If you want to see more tangible sacrifices, just wait until we expand our freedom-bringing to Iran and Syria - then we'll get rationing, energy shortages, . . . and the draft! AZ Mod, I agree with some of PL's premise. Today's college students are the antithesis from the activist students of the late 60's. The absence of the draft, and the religion of borrow-to-spend-consumerism above all else are probably responsible for the complete disconnect of so many of today's youth. Today's activists tend to come from a somewhat older and more diverse crowd, and I expect that their numbers will grow as Bushinomics hits more and more of the middle class in the pockets. |
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Jul. 28, 2006 at 12:58:52 AM
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| To Ohio Nut Case, When a reservist takes his oath, it is the culmination of a contract with his country. Part of that contract is that we will not conduct a war, which is illegal or immoral. The occupation in Iraq is both. We do our country and its service personnel a disservice when we don’t stand up and complain. The powers in charge are a bunch of Chickenhawks who avoided service during Vietnam, and now use our Armed Forces as cannon fodder for their personal political and religious aims. To Average American, Attacking the messenger instead of the message is the last refuge of the ignorant. Offend a Conservative – Use Your Brain [link:aproudliberal.blogspot.com] |
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Jul. 28, 2006 at 04:39:29 AM
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| Not too sure what military contract you have read - but I know mine never made such a statement !! For the good, or the bad - the contract you sign when commiting to the U.S. military is pretty much one-sided - all for the government's side. With one very final statement at the end - "May Be Changed To Meet The Needs of the United Strates Government". And - just to make sure there is clarity here - reservists, guardsmen AND regular Army, Navy, Marine, Air Force, and Coast Guardsmen ALL sign the same contract, and take the same oath in the same room at the same time !!! They all swear to defend and protect in the homeland and abroad - whenever the government (state or federal) deems it necessary. It DOESN'T say you can pick and choose your own battles, or choose to sit on the sidelines because you have a hangnail that day. And they DO have processes to identify "Conciensious Objectors" (sp?). And when one is identified, they are NOT placed in war-zones where they may have to go against their beliefs and kill - they are kept in non-frontline jobs. The government realizes that even though they are not willing to kill for their country - they wish to serve her all the same !! Now then, the bleeding hearts can all argue that the government is making cannibals out of these men - making them kill, or leave their families on a moment's notice - all for the sake of something the government deems necessary - but it's been done for hundreds of years, and it is because of this process / tradition this country is still the free and proud country she will always remain !! |
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Jul. 28, 2006 at 07:41:17 AM
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| "the mindless hood ornament on the NeoCoNazi political hummer". What a brilliant line! az mod you are good a great writer!. Steinbeck woulda been proud of that one.
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Jul. 28, 2006 at 11:39:10 AM
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| ONC- Lest I be trite, Lincoln said, “and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth,” at the end of the Gettysburg Address. Government is not a black box issuing edicts from on high. Every citizen has not only the right but also the obligation to object when actions taken in their name are illegal and immoral. There many things about America to be proud of, Iraq is not one of them. The misuse of our military and the killing of civilians are plainly wrong. As for being free, that lessens everyday under the current regime. This from [link:www.counterpunch.org] The military oath taken at the time of induction reads: "I,____________, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to the regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God" The Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) 809.ART.90 (20), makes it clear that military personnel need to obey the "lawful command of his superior officer," 891.ART.91 (2), the "lawful order of a warrant officer", 892.ART.92 (1) the "lawful general order", 892.ART.92 (2) "lawful order". In each case, military personnel have an obligation and a duty to only obey Lawful orders and indeed have an obligation to disobey Unlawful orders, including orders by the president that do not comply with the UCMJ. The moral and legal obligation is to the U.S. Constitution and not to those who would issue unlawful orders, especially if those orders are in direct violation of the Constitution and the UCMJ. These were established because of the Nuremburg trials after WWII where the excuse, “I was just obeying orders,” was used. This inclusion in the UCMJ was to ensure that American personnel would not be guilty of similar crimes. Offend a Conservative – Use Your Brain [link:aproudliberal.blogspot.com] |
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Jul. 28, 2006 at 12:09:16 PM
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| But the one point you are missing here is that - better than 95% of the military - if not all - believe in what they are doing, and do not feel this is an "illegal" war. You don't think that - IF - just ONE soldier felt this was an illegal military action, he or she wouldn't have not just run, but sprinted to the media, and made the case that he or she does not have to follow his or her orders ?!?!?! COME ON - Give me a break !!! That would be a media HEY DAY !!!!! If this WERE something to be exploited - It would have been done long ago - and there would have been lines to do it !!! You think those on this web site have the corner on being liberals?!?! I am sure there are a fair share in the military - Why don't you write a few of them, and make the suggestion they complain that they are fighting an illegal war - and they want to take their ball and go home ! You are taking such a fine line of idiocy - it is pathetic !!! I agree with AA - Until you can use what little brain you have - I have no further comments.
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Jul. 28, 2006 at 03:18:41 PM
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| What is being a conscientious objector? Is it going up to your commanding officer and handing him your gun, assuring yourself a quick trip to the brig until your status and disposition are decided? Or is it some 21 year old kid that enlisted three years ago to bring the people who did 9-11 to justice, and now has no idea WTF they're accomplishing in Iraq other than putting their body parts on the line everyday? I hate poll questions. There's a big difference between asking a soldier the question "Do you want to stay and win the war in Iraq?" and "Do you think we're accomplishing anything here?" The answer to the first question has always been "yes," and the answer to the second question is increasingly "no." And yet, these misleading poll questions are used to argue both sides of the issue. Bottom line: it is unfair to lay this country's war policy on the shoulders of the young fighting men and women. It is not their job to stand up and say this war is illegal - it is every American's. In the same vein, it is not exactly fair to expect them to recognize and disobey every illegal order that may come their way - that's much easier said than done. ONC, I cannot agree with your logic that the war isn't wrong because otherwise the troops would refuse to fight. That is not a real option. Nor do I believe that they would rushing to be the first in their unit to express their doubts and concerns to the Press. That doesn't play well with the other guys. Nor do I believe that the soldiers in an all volunteer army are the pacifists of society, or that they should be. 95% of the soldiers believe in what they are doing, you say. Great. And I bet that 100% have no idea why they are doing it. Which statistic do you think Bill O'Reilly is going to go with? |
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"It should be noted that in Vietnam unlike the Gulf Wars, there were NO reservists or National Guard troops called up to duty in country." - NO - there was a draft, our forces were no where near the levels of today - both active, and reserve / guardsmen, therefore, we had to bring more in - involuntarily.
"This is because neither Johnson nor Nixon felt they had the political capital necessary to make such a move. " NO - but they sure felt the "capital" to draft people!!!
"The mainstream media would not have let them get away with doing so. " - OOOH - here the truth comes out - the MEDIA run the show around here !!! The MEDIA dictates what the government can and can not do !! Hmm...I thought it was the constitution that gave the government the rights they have to do the things they do, not CNN, MSNBC, and FOXNEWS!!!!!
"The country is not asked to make any wartime sacrifices." - Do you think maybe the lack of war-time scarifices is mainly due to the fact that this country is in better financial / agricultural / industrial / technological shape than it was back then?!?! We are a society of abundance / excess, if you will. Both fortunately and UNfortunately, the main and only resource we have to sacrifice is our men and women who serve. And as harsh as this may sound (and I say this as a veteran - so don't come back at me with "you don't know" !!), Reservists and Guardsmen KNOW the possibilities when they raise their right hand and swear to defend and protect !!! I feel bad for, and HATE every life lost, and family disrupted by this war - believe me I do - but I DO NOT feel bad for those who want to whine about having to be called up to serve - when that is what they signed up for, and swore to do, if the need ever arrose. We give these people loads of money in sign on bonuses, re-enlistment bonuses, and GI Bill and other college monies - it's not just a give-a-way! We expect that IF and WHEN the time comes - that person will willingly hold up their end of the bargain!!!
But once again - I am just a worthless nut
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